So if there was a possibility...?

[Osvir]

... to dub this... would you take it? I have a studio at home, or rather... my dad's studio (but I bet I could borrow it). I know a LOT of people that are very good actors. Though I am unsure about the voice acting quality, they are great stage actors. But that's a little bit different :p I know a lot of people with different types of voices as well, many of them could be very fitting for some of the characters. So if a voice dub could be possible... could it be possible to imprint it into the game, or a different patch?

Oh and this would of course be all for free.

And I would need the game script as well. Though my main idea with this is that this project begins AFTER the main patch is done. The quality can only become one thing "Top notch". Because there is nothing, NOTHING, I dislike and hate more than bad voice acting in a game. So if you think this is something that could be interesting (this whole thread is mostly directed to the Team, but of course to the members as well) PM me with a short script and I can "audition" with it. See how it sound, if the voice is good enough etc. etc.

EDIT: Oh and the studio is top notch. A proffessional studio.

[Bartlebycs]

I highly doubt they'll take you up on this offer, unless you and your friends took a professional acting class.  Then there'd be a 5% chance of Cless hiring you  

Not that I don't think it's a great idea, I'm just going by what Cless and co. have been saying all along.

But then I'd be happy either way, as long as the text is translated.

Edit: If they at least listened to your auditions, I'd be 100% satisfied.  Who knows, you guys might not suck, and Phantasian Productions can have the bragging rights that "they discovered those guys that went on to do hundreds of other anime". The US only has a handful of VO's right now, so we could certainly use more

[pedrocasilva]

From the ToP FAQ, should apply here too:

What about voice actors? Are you going to dub the game's voices into English?

There are zero plans of doing this. I'm not against the idea (in fact, I'd love to do it if it were possible), but the costs of hiring a professional studio to record voice acting are prohibitive. Second, modifying the data would be very tedious and difficult to do. Third, even if we had access to "free" voice actors (fans), I still wouldn't do it. I'd rather leave this kind of thing to professionals.

tbh, I think that's a whole extra layer of things to go wrong and not only that... I hate dubs hence why I go for undubs and dual audio every time I can >_< so, if you were to do it, I hope applying english audio was optional, and more than that... a separate project altogether. (even if phantasian studios was still involved) Even if we're not involved you can do it though, seeing that a lot of people these days opens the ISO's and swaps the audio files, providing there are tools for this one it should be doable.

This said, the dubbing process could be fun, and in that respect it is something I'd follow... But not wish to play it like that, although let's say, just like I like to play stuff with original audio and I like to have the option I understand why some might want a dub instead and I think having the option would be neat, providing it was optional.

I guess you'll have to wait for a Cless response though, perhaps you can offer him to record the opening sequence voices or something, as a test? good luck nevertheless.

[Osvir]

This said, the dubbing process could be fun, and in that respect it is something I'd follow... But not wish to play it like that, although let's say, just like I like to play stuff with original audio and I like to have the option I understand why some might want a dub instead and I think having the option would be neat, providing it was optional.

I honestly agree with you 100%. Undubs are the best, always, period. But there are those that do want dubs for some reason. And I think I understand that as well. You can grow closer to the game and the story if you do not need to read all the time, and you can relate when a language you understand is spoken.

There are two reasons why I would want to do this:
ONE: Is because it would be fun. I love to act. I am an actor after all. (Which is my answer to:

I know a LOT of people that are very good actors.

I highly doubt they'll take you up on this offer, unless you and your friends took a professional acting class.

TWO: Some people would like to see it. Some people would like to have it dubbed, and if I could provide these people with this oppertunity then I would like to do it.

Sure I know how to record sound and so on. But it is on a whole different level to know how to put it into a game. Into the core of the game. Knowing what kind of file you need and so on. What do you need to convert it with? Etc. etc. there are pretty many things that I do not understand regarding that.

Third, even if we had access to "free" voice actors (fans), I still wouldn't do it. I'd rather leave this kind of thing to professionals.

This is not stating that they want proffessional voice actors. But rather a proffessional crew that knows how to handle all the above, the audio files, coding that into the game, making all that function. The sound connecting at the right moment, no speaking past a certain point. Sometimes you have like 5 seconds of air, then you HAVE to stop or it'll sound (and look) really bad. All of this IS its own level of understanding and knowledge.

And if the Phantasian Productions are knowledgeable about this but they want "famous" or "proffessional" Voice Actors then I think they are narrow minded.

I clearly state it, I have a proffessional studio, I have knowledge, I am an actor and I know how to form an actor! (Though stage actor, theatre mostly). And I am huge fan of the gaming industry and the theatrical of the games ("How do you say it?" "When do you say it?"), I have played bad games, good games. I have read thousands of stories, many of them bad, many of them good. I have heard bad voice actors and I have heard good voice actors. I know when something works, and when it doesn't work. I have the knowledge and understanding of that.

Let me at least try. Give me a... 2-5 minute dialogue and I'll study it, work with it and put together a recording of it. Give me a chance. If it sucks or doesn't fit at all, we'll just skip it. If it is good, or functional then we can think about it at least.

I have all the resources to make this happen. Well, the last piece is someone who knows how to put it into the game, or to be honest... the file/data.

if you were to do it, I hope applying english audio was optional, and more than that... a separate project altogether.

Yeah, it is exactly what it would be. Probably something that would be finished and released AFTER the translation patch was done.

Anyways, I'm out... I'll wait for some sort of response from Cless or anyone from the team. There is also a probability that I will make this a project individually, but the translation has to be finished first. And by that time, Phantasian Productions, I will ask for your "Okay" if you allow me to make a dub for the game.

[throughhim413]

Undubs are the best, always, period.

*Whistles* I really have to disagree with you there. Undubs are only useful if you don't know Japanese. Anime subtitle tracks work because the subtitles are specifically written to reflect the Japanese. With an undub (or even when including the Japanese audio as an option), the dialogue is all written for the dub. The result is a game in which the written text doesn't match up with the Japanese audio.

In order for dual audio games to be viable, a game would ideally include both a "subtitle" and a dub script. Depending on which audio option you select, it loads the proper script. The final result here is that most of the subtitle script would read like ass, but hey, at least it would be a proper translation instead of these mismatched undubs.

Just my opinion of course, but the only reason that I would touch an undub is if I wanted to check out how they translated certain lines or if the dub is somehow incomplete (Ar tonelico II style).

[Demon000]

*Whistles* I really have to disagree with you there. Undubs are only useful if you don't know Japanese. Anime subtitle tracks work because the subtitles are specifically written to reflect the Japanese. With an undub (or even when including the Japanese audio as an option), the dialogue is all written for the dub. The result is a game in which the written text doesn't match up with the Japanese audio.

In order for dual audio games to be viable, a game would ideally include both a "subtitle" and a dub script. Depending on which audio option you select, it loads the proper script. The final result here is that most of the subtitle script would read like ass, but hey, at least it would be a proper translation instead of these mismatched undubs.

Just my opinion of course, but the only reason that I would touch an undub is if I wanted to check out how they translated certain lines or if the dub is somehow incomplete (Ar tonelico II style).

I see your point but there are times when the dub is just sooooo bad...

[Osvir]

What I meant with "undubs are the best, always, period" was a generalization of "Usually the voice acting is much better". It has nothing to do with the words, really, it may be the worst script ever! But in all japanese voice acting I have ever heard, they really have an ability to express and give you feeling. That is what I meant... it has nothing to do with the actual script, it is how you express the script and how you read the script. And sometimes it do sound like, in many game dubs, that they do not express the script. That's why I like undubs. My opinion. And I respect your opinion ^^

[Shawn]

What I meant with "undubs are the best, always, period" was a generalization of "Usually the voice acting is much better". It has nothing to do with the words, really, it may be the worst script ever! But in all japanese voice acting I have ever heard, they really have an ability to express and give you feeling. That is what I meant... it has nothing to do with the actual script, it is how you express the script and how you read the script. And sometimes it do sound like, in many game dubs, that they do not express the script. That's why I like undubs. My opinion. And I respect your opinion ^^

But if you don't have a somewhat-fluent grasp of Japanese, it would only "sound" superior. Only someone who has a good knowledge of both languages could say if one was better than the other.

The whole JAPANESEFTW! selection of anime viewers is partially why anime is somewhat rocky right now in America. Instead of supporting the anime when it's released, they'll download the torrent for the sub and stick with that. There's been a bunch of anime, like Cowboy Bebop or Death Note, in which even the people who watched the sub admit the English version is generally better.

[Osvir]

The whole JAPANESEFTW! selection of anime viewers is partially why anime is somewhat rocky right now in America. Instead of supporting the anime when it's released, they'll download the torrent for the sub and stick with that. There's been a bunch of anime, like Cowboy Bebop or Death Note, in which even the people who watched the sub admit the English version is generally better.

I have not stated "anime" once (except now). So I do not know where the "anime" (twice) comes into play? I am talking about games.

[Shawn]

I have not stated "anime" once (except now). So I do not know where the "anime" (twice) comes into play? I am talking about games.

Generally the whole "Japanese>all" stems from subbies.. It was a basic comment about it. I wasn't saying you in particular were part of it. It's just that most of the OMGSUB=WIN seems to come from people who are pro-sub in anime.

[Dimentionalist]

Answer will probably be no... but I'm confident that Cless will make the right decision.

I wouldn't mind a dub, really, unless it was done with people with real acting experience be it stage, whatever, ect, or if they're really, really good. I've seen plenty of people online on gaming and Tales forums who dub themselves "voice actors" when in reality, when you hear what they've done, they're just... ugh...

[Osvir]

I wouldn't mind a dub, really, unless it was done with people with real acting experience be it stage, whatever, ect, or if they're really, really good. I've seen plenty of people online on gaming and Tales forums who dub themselves "voice actors" when in reality, when you hear what they've done, they're just... ugh...

To be completely honest, I've never dubbed or been in any sort of dubbing project. I do not state such a thing that I have experience with that. One of the main reasons why I want to try it. My voice is not fit for it, but I have friends that have the voice fit for it (At least fit for the characters of Tales of Destiny). I am more the "Director" and "Editor".

I have both movie and stage experience. So it isn't like "Hey! This dude does not know what he is doing!" or anything similar. You get a certain eye and certain ears for this kind of thing when you've been involved with theatre and movies. Your teachers words speak within your mind when you watch a movie, a theatre, or even playing a video game. You get a knowledge to know "Why" you should act in a certain manner and "How" you should act in that manner.

Anyways, now you know that this project will start. But as previously stated, it will not start until the translation is done. So that I can work with a valid game script. And it also depends on what Phantasian Productions says as well. If they say "No" now I'll try it anyways, I want to see what they say WHEN they have received the test. Of course if there is any other problematics with this, like "knowledge of how to put into the game" and what kind of file you need, filesize of that etc. etc. if it is knowledge that Phantasian do not have, then it is safe to say that this project won't happen.

Because why would I make a dub if you can't imprint it into the game? :p

EDIT: Alright, I managed to extract all of the sound files from Tales of Destiny DC. A little above 14000 files :p everything from blips in the menu to dialogue clips. 0 to 5 second clips, some could be a little longer. Didn't exactly have time to analyze all of them. So it isn't exactly much margin there... now the problem I have is to put everything back to what it was (.DAT). That's where my knowledge fails me.

And I quickly learned that the files are not in order with the game (of course) but instead organized in different manner. As an example, Stahn's action (in-battle) sound comes first (after 2 or 3 blips, most likely menu). Special attacks like Majinken, Kogahazan etc. etc. So this is definately problematic, how to know which clip is the right one. Imagine putting the wrong dialogue at the wrong place. Suddenly Rutee talks when it is supposed to be Stahn :p well that isn't the problem really, the real problem lies in "Which clip is supposed to go where?". Stahn's first dialogue, which clips are those? And that's some heavy analyzing... got to play the game. Pause every 5 seconds, check 14000 files for the right sound and voice. Bah! :p but it isn't impossible. *goes to do just that now*

[pedrocasilva]

best way to do it, I feel... if Cless gives out a kind of greenlight for it, would be making a test of the cast, reprising their role (kinda like a casting expect phantasian productions won't be casting, more like analyzing the potential of such project with the talent we supposedly have at hand) for a previous chosen scene, kinda like a proof of concept and then analyze the end quality.

Of course, the final acting for such acts might be improved later when actors get into it and with several different takes as well as cosmetic changes, both in the script (that should still be too early to be final) and in the pronunciation (for instance, I think it's natural for a translator to remark that the way "x" actor says ... Stahn (stan?) is not accurate with the Japanese romanization of the name (I'm talking out of my ass, so don't mind me if I'm sprouting crap) same for japanese expressions kept, which I don't know if the game has, or if they'll be kept (for example: japanese address -kun), but all in all... I mean... proper direction and decisions that will arise and won't be fine tuned initially.

Where was I going? ah, yes, if Cless+throughhim413 would be open to trying, I think before compromising they should test what we really have at hands (not doubting you, but they'd be compromising so I think it's fair, just like I don't think you'd want to dub a script of questionable end quality, I believe; and plus, they'll have extra work applying it).

I wouldn't mind a dub, really, unless it was done with people with real acting experience be it stage, whatever, ect, or if they're really, really good. I've seen plenty of people online on gaming and Tales forums who dub themselves "voice actors" when in reality, when you hear what they've done, they're just... ugh...

I actually don't care at all if they're real actors or not, as long as it sounds good/is a good job. Of course that requires experience and all, but let's put it this way... I'm sure ToSDotNW actors had prior experience and it still mostly sounded like dope, as did other dubs...

Or even better... let's turn it other way. the best videogame dub I ever heard in my whole life was the Baten Kaitos Origins one, and I mean better than Final Fantasy XII, to the point I, being anti-dub's wouldn't want to play the game with japanese voice-overs, because they are just so spot on.

Yet... main actor for Sagi was... Crawford Wilson, what else did he do? erm... quick google tells me he is famous for baten kaitos origins, what else? erm... nothing? and the main girl, with a hellishly sensual voice? hmmm, Shanelle Workman? who's that? no previous game experience too, famous for One Life to Live ABC soap opera? WTF?

That's right, they did a main cast out of no-names, that sounds better than FFX bullcrap all over with "famous" dubbing actors, and probably came out cheaper.

My point? none really, just that I don't judge a book by it's cover, and I want more Shanelle Workman or whatever she's called in my games, I don't care if she isn't known for dubs or for anything else, really, I care that her work awed me.

[throughhim413]

The biggest problem I can imagine is the one that you mentioned - someone would have to ID thousands of audio files. If they're in some contextual order, that's one thing, but if they're sorted by character as I imagine they might be, well... let's just say I'd rather have my teeth pulled than do that. Basically, unless there's some way to pair up the audio with the translated script (which could be quite difficult), I'd say it sounds rather unrealistic.

[Craymel]

I actually don't care at all if they're real actors or not, as long as it sounds good/is a good job. Of course that requires experience and all, but let's put it this way... I'm sure ToSDotNW actors had prior experience and it still mostly sounded like dope, as did other dubs...

Or even better... let's turn it other way. the best videogame dub I ever heard in my whole life was the Baten Kaitos Origins one, and I mean better than Final Fantasy XII, to the point I, being anti-dub's wouldn't want to play the game with japanese voice-overs, because they are just so spot on.

Yet... main actor for Sagi was... Crawford Wilson, what else did he do? erm... quick google tells me he is famous for baten kaitos origins, what else? erm... nothing? and the main girl, with a hellishly sensual voice? hmmm, Shanelle Workman? who's that? no previous game experience too, famous for One Life to Live ABC soap opera? WTF?

That's right, they did a main cast out of no-names, that sounds better than FFX bullcrap all over with "famous" dubbing actors, and probably came out cheaper.

My point? none really, just that I don't judge a book by it's cover, and I want more Shanelle Workman or whatever she's called in my games, I don't care if she isn't known for dubs or for anything else, really, I care that her work awed me.

I'd say the problem with american dubbing for translated games and anime is not no name actors (as long as they're good actors I don't care what their names are) it's more the way it's done. I'm not going to get too deep into this debate because whenever I do I always go on youtube comparing several shows and games with their original audio and their english dub only to confirm what I already knew: I like the original audio better. So basically as I stated some where on this forum before, voice actors who work on dubs usually are in black recording booths alone with little to no direction. What's worse is the actors don't act out scenes together when their characters are in the same scene. In fact most likely voice actors in dubs would barely even meet the other cast members till maybe the end of the project as they're scheduled at different times. One of the problems I have with the english dubs is that sometimes characters reactions to each other are really off. Before I new the actual process of dubs I would wounder if the characters were actually in the same room half the time... The best video game dub I've heard was final fantasy XII. Easily beats Baten Kaitos origins in my opinion

[pedrocasilva]

^you raise a good point.

The best video game dub I've heard was final fantasy XII. Easily beats Baten Kaitos origins in my opinion

I mentioned FFXII precisely because it is a pretty good dub. But... Baten Kaitos Origins wins that, at least when it comes to the 3 main actors. (or 4, considering guillo has two voice actors, a male and a female)

For me, anyway, of course I respect your opinion (but BKO feels better )

The biggest problem I can imagine is the one that you mentioned - someone would have to ID thousands of audio files. If they're in some contextual order, that's one thing, but if they're sorted by character as I imagine they might be, well... let's just say I'd rather have my teeth pulled than do that. Basically, unless there's some way to pair up the audio with the translated script (which could be quite difficult), I'd say it sounds rather unrealistic.

there should be a way to open the audio files one by one and just re-record that, no? although granted, even if we know what was there we'd have to search how that was translated in the final script... feed the lines and then go back into each character sorting and dumping the aforementioned tracks there (ugh)

But yeah, you're probably right, a whole extra layer of monotonous work nonetheless... and testing. I'd feel for you.