Now that ToP Is Translated What Games Next?

[Frogacuda]

One thing that really pisses me off: his approach is not literal, he's just accurate. There's a huge difference.

By literal I mean it's focused on meaning exclusively, and not tone or voice. Parts of it sound oddly formal and it really doesn't capture the character's voice.

That said, if I wasn't comparing this to other projects I wouldn't be as picky, and I have to say it's a very good effort overall. The hacking work is fantastic, and the ability-name option is a very nice touch. You should be proud of the patch.

I don't mean to imply that the project is rushed, because clearly a fantastic amount of hacking work went into it and I'm really impressed with how clean and complete it is.

It could use a writer's touch, that's all. There's a reason most projects let someone other than the translator do the editing. A professional writer will go over it afterwards and clean up style-related things. That has nothing to do with rushing or not trying hard enough, or either of your work not being good enough.

[throughhim413]

That's a fair evaluation.  I accept that fact that my style has odd quirks to it, and certainly anyone paying much attention to the script could come up with more than a few examples.  It would be nice to have professional editing with every release, but in this case, it wasn't feasible to track someone down and get that done.  I mean, I'm always up for a more refined script, but with everything else in its final version, we just weren't ready to hold up the hack to take it from (what we considered to be) great to perfect.  Obviously if this were a commercial release, it would be a different story, but we felt the game was enjoyable and quite presentable in its current form.  I suppose my personal feeling on the matter is that our patch isn't really lacking, it's just that there's always room for improvement.  And perhaps it seems kind of silly for me to say it when Cless has been working on it for so much longer, but I'm ready to take a much needed break from ToP for a while.

[habilain]

As a note to people speculating on what comes next, I already have an interest in doing another project after ToP (Not ToD2; my hardware is somewhat lacking for emulating a PS2, and in any case PS2 emulation isn't all it's cracked up to be at the moment). However, until I've at least made a start on it I'm not going to be announcing anything. Only that it shouldn't take anywhere near as long as this one did. No, I will not comment further, so you'll probably be in something like suspense for a while. Maybe 'till late spring/early summer? I dunno.

However, before that, I'm going to actually make my Assembler/Dissembler into a finished product and release it into the wild, so there will be a break. HabDec is fast becoming a very powerful tool for PSX hacking. It needs a couple of more features before I'll be happy to release it into the wild, and for most of those I have beta code for.

[Frogacuda]

Yeah, I'm not trying to nitpick you to death, throughhim. Like I said, you knowingly put yourself in a position where people would make comparisons and that doesn't mean you shouldn't feel proud of your work.

After all, this is, to my knowledge, the first completed PSX translation of this size. That alone is a major barrier to break down.

Also, I'm a writer by profession, including video game script writing, so I may be a bit pickier than most since it's kind of my job to notice these things.

[Cless]

Can we get back to thoughts on the future and come away with second guessing projects that have already come to pass?  Seriously, start a new thread if you feel like justifying yourselves, or implying that certain translations are sub-par, or trying to reinterpret reasonable answers as implications of lack of quality.

My vote is for Tod2, since it would be nice to get some ps2 hacking experience; the first Tales game released on ps2 seems like a good start. Or possibly "Tales of Cless's Much-Needed Vacation From the Internets", a rare title, known only in select circles that have been following the tales series for seven plus years.  I shall have to decide.

I'm having a bit trouble putting my thoughts into words, but, dude. May I make a request that you stop attacking the Absolute Zero project and the people behind it? Even though this thread got derailed quite early on, the resulting discussion has been fairly rational. I don't want to have to lock this one as well. Constructive criticism is fine, but seriously, this looks more like trolling.

I no longer have any issue with what AZ has done, and want to keep the peace. Our project is still coming along.

[NekoGnash]

EVENTUALLY I would like to see someone attempt either Tales of Rebirth or the Tales of Destiny Remake [that was the one for ps2 right?] and naturally Tales of Destiny 2... ... heck Super Robot Wars would be a bonus too!!!

[Carnivol]

In the case of a ToDr project, I honestly think it's best to atleast wait for the Director's Cut version to be released. Not only because it'll be the most "up to date" version, but also because it'll be on the same platform as the previous version and it may or may not contain technical alterations that "could" make a lot of work done on the current version somewhat... wasted.

[gyozilla]

throughhim, I didn't want to talk about the issues so soon since it might be thought of as a flame instead of critiquing on the work, but I see people mentioning accuracy so many times,  so I had to speak up. It was many things I noticed that just aren't what the original source meant. These are just a few edits I will mention, take them as you will (maybe for a possible update); I've only took a look at menu stuff so I don't know about dialogue: the Eternal Sword is not sentient, Rosania's Dress is stained instead of spotless, Quicksilver's (using the ancient name of Mercury to fit ToP's setting) description isn't a result of failed alchemy but a must-have item for alchemists, Suzu's Shiranui is a mythological reference to Fool's Fire / Will O' Wisp so it shouldn't have stayed as the literal Unknown Fire, the Beef and Fish Hot Pot can have Chicken and Squid/Octopus in it so the names aren't really appropriate, and Methodism really should not have been used for houjutsu.

The old Greek Methodist theory of medicine has nothing to do with what houjutsu is. They were separate from Dogmatists (they research and theorize) and Empiricists (they treat by experience), and theorized not to focus on researching the cause of diseases nor the organ affected, but on the qualities of the symptoms. Houjutsu afaik originates from Taoism, relating with Ki/Chi, Taichi, and all that. The 法 is related to 法師 (houshi, Buddhist/Taoist priest) and other Buddhism/Taoism terms. That's why it makes sense houjutsu is about inner willpower energies, not from the earth and wind. This doesn't mean switch to Taoism though...

I appreciate original references and the process in bringing idioms/ideas across languages, so let me know if I'm wrong about Methodism. For what it's worth from little o' me, that was quick work on the script and chats. My major critique of style is that kanji skills (Cless' moves) are artsy and poetic by nature so those aspects should've been reflected more. I know you wanted to test yourself to see how you would do, but an editor wouldn't have been able to catch those mistakes; you needed another translator, at least a supporting one for a game this big. If you care about other possible edits I saw, let me know through PM.

[throughhim413]

I trust you don't mind if we continue this in PM, do you?  I'd like to continue the discussion, but I fear this thread is probably ill-suited for that purpose.

EDIT: For anyone else reading, I'll just mention that some of these are legitimate mistakes while I think some of them aren't so wrong.

EDIT 2: Sorry for a late edit, but I just also want to note that I never made the claim to be perfect.  I'm a human being like anyone else, obviously I make mistakes.  My apologies if any of them made it through to the final release.

[LJkAze]

also, it seems like everyone (e.g. LJkAze) somehow missed my ND2 update ;_;

indeed Kajitani, I would help out in anyway but after I am fluent in all the Hiragana, Katakana, and Romaji. I beat ND2 and kinda know the story but I rather play it 100% in english

[Saikyo]

Too lazy to register in romhacking dot net

Pressing start in some events restart them in gemini translation, leftover from debug?
There´s also a problem using multitap(don´t work) but that´s an emulator problem (same thing with eternia/destiny 2).

See Ya!

[stahn]

Konnichiwa, minna-san. This is Stahn.

I don't see the point in arguing with project is better ,  faster released or more or less accuracy DAMN it really doesn't matter at all.

You people are simply amazing just to do something like that !!! I am very proud of YOU that I can finally, after so many years of waiting play one of the best (if not the BEST) Tales game ever made fully on with ENGLISH translation script.

And witch the same proud I will play ::::Cless Team patch version:::: not to compare the differences or witch patch is better NO!!!

I will play that for my self to admire both project That take soooo loooongggg of theirs lives and "eye toy" my eyes and heart that I finally can understand every single quote said in the game 

not only the main story but every single townspeople !!!!!!! 

If only those BASTARDS in NAMCO released Tales game in the beginning ...  but screw them EVERY BODY WE GOT PEOPLE LIKE THEM who kind enough to release patch for us normal fun players and not to keep the patch to themselfs !!!

My poin is ... If someone complain THAN DO IT BETTER YOURSELFS ASSCHOLES !!! Aileron-ryuu Hisatsu Ougi, Stahn Tornado!

::::::NO OFENSE TO ANYONE::::::

[Cless]

Konnichiwa, minna-san. This is Stahn.

I don't see the point in arguing with project is better ,  faster released or more or less accuracy DAMN it really doesn't matter at all.

You people are simply amazing just to do something like that !!! I am very proud of YOU that I can finally, after so many years of waiting play one of the best (if not the BEST) Tales game ever made fully on with ENGLISH translation script.

And witch the same proud I will play ::::Cless Team patch version:::: not to compare the differences or witch patch is better NO!!!

I will play that for my self to admire both project That take soooo loooongggg of theirs lives and "eye toy" my eyes and heart that I finally can understand every single quote said in the game 

not only the main story but every single townspeople !!!!!!! 

If only those BASTARDS in NAMCO released Tales game in the beginning ...  but screw them EVERY BODY WE GOT PEOPLE LIKE THEM who kind enough to release patch for us normal fun players and not to keep the patch to themselfs !!!

My poin is ... If someone complain THAN DO IT BETTER YOURSELFS ASSCHOLES !!! Aileron-ryuu Hisatsu Ougi, Stahn Tornado!

::::::NO OFENSE TO ANYONE::::::

I... really don't think that was necessary...

[Frogacuda]

I disagree. I think it was the most necessary post I've ever seen. And asschole is my new favorite word.

[Infoseeker]

Code:

Cless' project here will be using the scaled (psp?) sprites; right?

I felt that it would be a significant difference to mention; if I am remembering correctly. At least that makes me want to assign more brownie points in one direction.

[Kajitani-Eizan]

i had the impression that cless wasn't using the PSP sprites.