Bandai Namco: Huge Support for Wii

[throughhim413]

I apologize, I've been unclear in what I've been saying, thus causing a lot of back and forth between us even though what we're saying isn't that different.  I'm not saying that games won't look better on the PS3 then they do on the PS2.  And I didn't mean to say that PS1 games looked better then PS2 games.  What I was saying was that, for anime style games like Tales (and ONLY for anime style games), the difference won't be all that significant, at least not right away.  My logic for that is the following:  Tales games can only be graphically improved in 3 areas of any significance (well, 4 if you count the world map).  1) Battle graphics - certainly improvements in this area are great.  Usually they're more subtle or sometimes not, but they go a long way to improve the feel of the battles.  2) Character models for story - You know, when the characters are standing around talking.  Abyss really showed that there's still plenty of room for improvement, particularly in terms of facial expressions and motion.  But this can only be improved so far, like I mentioned previously, everything at this point is just smoothing the models over.  That's the nature of the style that Tales is done in, which I don't consider to be a downside.  3) Skits - It still doesn't seem like they've settled on any one skit graphic.  Someday, they might be full motion just like the story conversations, but hey, I'll even take voice-overs on them at this point, so a lot stands to be improved.

Also, I didn't mean to imply that there was no 3D before the PS2, just that by the time we got to the PS2, everything was in 3D.  I mean goodness, Super Mario RPG for the SNES was in 3D, so I wouldn't try to claim otherwise.  I completely agree with what you said about the more recent Tales games having significant graphical improvements.  Especially in the battle systems, there is much that has been improved on in terms of graphics.  I've not played Eternia or Rebirth yet (sadly), but I would never try to argue that things aren't improving.  Though, I have to admit, I still love sprite games like Phantasia.  Cel shading and sprite games are my two favorite styles, so this is part of where my general disregard for graphics comes into play.  But that's just personal taste, I'm not trying to say that they're graphically superior.

I'm not trying to say that things won't look better.  They will.  This is the nature of gaming these days.  But I was trying to say that you aren't going to see the kind of drastic changes that you might in a franchise like Fight Night or Final Fantasy, among others, which depend on the graphics as a major type of the appeal.  From the beginning, the main point I was trying to make (or at least that I intended to make) was not that graphics aren't improving, but that I don't feel like the improvements, at least for games like Tales, will be SO significant that I'll immediately shell out $600 (or even $400) for a system and then $60-90 for the game.  But, it's certainly possible that I'm entirely wrong about the amount games will improve.  They certainly have the potential to do beyond what I'm predicting, and there's no way to tell except to wait and see.  But personally, I'd much rather see Tales switch to the Wii then go the PS3 route.

So, hopefully that was a little more clear...  You're still welcome to disagree with me of course, this is all just opinion after all.  Plus, this has been a far more civil discussion than what I'm used to on most forums, so no worries, I don't think you're trying to be a dick or anything.  We're just discussing.

[Magicpaint]

If Tales games are supposed to emulate anime style, then I'd like for the games to come a bit closer to actual anime quality, as of now, they look pitiful compared to actual anime IMO. Yes, I already said I'm a graphics a whore, but you won't see me crying if it doesn't happen. BUT I want it to happen and the Wii can't do it for me, so naturally I want the PS3 to get some Tales fix.

Not only that, but the extra horsepower could actually enhance gameplay too, so it's not just graphics whoring (I talked about high production values too)!

[throughhim413]

Well, the problem with it being closer to actual anime is that the only way to do that (if they aren't going to use models) would be to actually animate everything.  Even with digi-cel, that's a huge amount of money to spend on animation.  It'd be awesome, but I don't know how it could be executed properly.  I really don't know what the best solution is for the cutscenes.  They had it easy back when the games were sprite based, but with the 3D models, they feel like they're lacking something...

[Magicpaint]

It's mostly wishful thinking in my own part, but the desire still holds. :p

Have you seen Trusty Bell? It's not exactly there, but it's a significant step-up from the 'anime-models' we've been getting in the 3D Tales. I wouldn't mind high-definition 2D with all the sprites drawn at that 720p resolution and up BUT that could possibly be even more expensive. Eitherway, I'll still settle for what I get, Tales is Tales.

[Leroy]

You know, I'm going to try to find if there are any 720p screenshots of Blue Dragon or Eternal Sonata floating around when I get home.. those are "anime" style games.. Eternal Sonata being cel-shaded if I recall correctly.. and yes, they look pretty freaking awesome compared to any PS2 "anime" style game. Then you can look at those and think that future 360 and PS3 titles can go higher (1080p).

[throughhim413]

I've seen Blue Dragon (and I think I've seen Eternal Sonata).  Those are two of the games I'm most interested in getting for next gen.  And I'll agree, they do look nicer than anything we have for the PS2.  And uh... no, that's it.  I don't have any argument with that.  But then again, those are 360 games.  And I'd be much more willing to support a 360 game just because the cost is significantly lower.  I'm certainly not asking for inferior graphics, I just... can't always afford the great ones.

[Leroy]

Tales of the Abyss, PS2, Resolution 480i:



Eternal Sonata, Xbox 360, Resolution 720p:

[throughhim413]

I actually came across that exact same screenshot earlier when I was looking around.  The difference is very noticable.  Like I mentioned above, the facial designs of the character models is one of the areas that most needs improvement.

[gyozilla]

A guy starts having doubts when a gaming console rivals that of a mid-range PC or a month's rent, s'all.

Sadly, a lot of games only get real recognition when graphics are cutting edge. I still love how some people don't even know Soul Calibur had a  semi-campy prequel that is Soul Blade / Soul Edge. I remember all the rage about SC's weapon flash effects / backdrop renderings / et al on the Dreamcast that solidified its status (aside from you know, the actual fighting system).

I guess the argument being made is sorta like a lot of things, an asymptote in graphics, until the industry breaks the mold and we go into VR or some other medium (might actually require breaking the 4th wall a lot more).

[Magicpaint]

Eternal Sonata is the US name for Trusty Bell.

[Leroy]

I actually came across that exact same screenshot earlier when I was looking around.  The difference is very noticable.  Like I mentioned above, the facial designs of the character models is one of the areas that most needs improvement.

The thing I really like about the above screenshot is the character's lips. They're part of the model and not just a texture pasted onto her face. There are individual eyelashes as well. I think these are huge differences, graphically of course. Though, it does seem that her ear looks like a texture.